Shoes and Ships and Sealing Wax
Oct. 21st, 2008 10:17 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
After Elton have a poll for the best gay books ever, my five? The Charioteer, At Swim Two Boys, As Meat Loves Salt, Swordspoint, Wicked Gentlemen. Perhaps the latter two aren't in the EVAH category, but the best I've read for a while - and ones that stick in my head, which is the point. Belimah sticks with me just as hard as Laurie for example.
I've bitten the bullet and told my editor that she'll have the rewrite done of Transgressions done by Sunday. This means I need to do 50 pages a day starting today. I'm hugely impressed with her work, actually - after the bad time I had with the edit of Standish - she's not done an historical before but she's working bloody hard to get her knowledge up to snuff - reading about the time period and - get this - checking just about every word for etymological correctness. (!!!)
Words that she's queried under the cut.
The book is based 1642-1649
Adam’s Apple -1755
cocoon - 1679
trek - 1821
erotic - 1651
vaporized - 1803
paralyzed - 1804
embargo - Spanish—1593 *I’m going to assume given the UK/Spanish relations that this work would have worked it’s way into the vocab by the time of the story)
ambiguous –1528, but since it’s Latin in origin, I’m going to go with them learning it from or through the church
pro bono - 1970
vilification - 1630
sniper - 1832
androgynous - 1651
foreplay - 1929
turgid - 1620
profligacy - 1738
scrotum - 1597—pertaining to animals
vacuum - 1550—you’d have to decide if such a concept would have made it’s way to them by the time of the story
automatic - 1748
claustrophobic - 1889
taciturn - 1734
hub - 1608—again, concept; hub of activity or hub of wheel?
lackadaisical - 1768
vibrato - 1876
ramshackle - 1830
recalcitrant - 1843
penis - 1668
flaccid - 1620
foramen - 1671
gauche - 1751
adroitly - 1652
skeptical - 1639
emigrate - 1776
spooning - 1715
Draconian - 1775
wheals —1808
sadist —1888;
boss —1653
travesty —1673
fatalistic —1678
presumably —1841, so never in speech or thought
Now this is an interesting dilemma because how far does one draw that line in historical fiction? I've seen this argued over and over again on the Historical Novelists Society. One can't actually write the speech in the exact manner that the people of the time really used because it would be 1. pretty impossible, due to dialects and boring the reader so how far does one really go in using anachronistic words?
Granted the term Adam's Apple wasn't around when my Cavalier is kissing his lover's AA - so does one erase it? Is it ok to use it in narrative but not in speech? Such as "The sweat glistened on David's skin, and his Adam's Apple jumped as he nervously contemplated what Tobias had in mind." but not in direct thought/speech? Such as: "The hollow of his throat and that lump is adorable" Hmmm. One must have had SOME kind of word for these concepts even if the word wasn't used. Plus of course, etymology uses the first written record of these terms, so perhaps we can give some ideas the benefit of the doubt.
Stuff like Draconian, mesmerism and sadism though - she's bang on target and I am slapping my hands for even putting these words in, but I find it fascinating, because I'm a word geek, that these words and concept are so much a part of our speech that I can call my Witchfinder a sadist (which he SO is) without even questioning where the word came from even though I know where it did.
'Tis a puzzlement. However - I'm going to try and winnow out as many of these words as I can - I don't think stuff like "presumably" is necessary - but most of them can be replaced.
What do you think? How far would you go? What about further back? Step back from the 17th century and the language becomes even more obscure.. I'm planning to do an Elizabethan one at one point - and I'm certainly not going to be writing the entire thing in nonnys and nuncles.
In other news, the cover is done and I should have it soon. I'm crossing EVERYTHING for a good one.
I've bitten the bullet and told my editor that she'll have the rewrite done of Transgressions done by Sunday. This means I need to do 50 pages a day starting today. I'm hugely impressed with her work, actually - after the bad time I had with the edit of Standish - she's not done an historical before but she's working bloody hard to get her knowledge up to snuff - reading about the time period and - get this - checking just about every word for etymological correctness. (!!!)
Words that she's queried under the cut.
The book is based 1642-1649
Adam’s Apple -1755
cocoon - 1679
trek - 1821
erotic - 1651
vaporized - 1803
paralyzed - 1804
embargo - Spanish—1593 *I’m going to assume given the UK/Spanish relations that this work would have worked it’s way into the vocab by the time of the story)
ambiguous –1528, but since it’s Latin in origin, I’m going to go with them learning it from or through the church
pro bono - 1970
vilification - 1630
sniper - 1832
androgynous - 1651
foreplay - 1929
turgid - 1620
profligacy - 1738
scrotum - 1597—pertaining to animals
vacuum - 1550—you’d have to decide if such a concept would have made it’s way to them by the time of the story
automatic - 1748
claustrophobic - 1889
taciturn - 1734
hub - 1608—again, concept; hub of activity or hub of wheel?
lackadaisical - 1768
vibrato - 1876
ramshackle - 1830
recalcitrant - 1843
penis - 1668
flaccid - 1620
foramen - 1671
gauche - 1751
adroitly - 1652
skeptical - 1639
emigrate - 1776
spooning - 1715
Draconian - 1775
wheals —1808
sadist —1888;
boss —1653
travesty —1673
fatalistic —1678
presumably —1841, so never in speech or thought
Now this is an interesting dilemma because how far does one draw that line in historical fiction? I've seen this argued over and over again on the Historical Novelists Society. One can't actually write the speech in the exact manner that the people of the time really used because it would be 1. pretty impossible, due to dialects and boring the reader so how far does one really go in using anachronistic words?
Granted the term Adam's Apple wasn't around when my Cavalier is kissing his lover's AA - so does one erase it? Is it ok to use it in narrative but not in speech? Such as "The sweat glistened on David's skin, and his Adam's Apple jumped as he nervously contemplated what Tobias had in mind." but not in direct thought/speech? Such as: "The hollow of his throat and that lump is adorable" Hmmm. One must have had SOME kind of word for these concepts even if the word wasn't used. Plus of course, etymology uses the first written record of these terms, so perhaps we can give some ideas the benefit of the doubt.
Stuff like Draconian, mesmerism and sadism though - she's bang on target and I am slapping my hands for even putting these words in, but I find it fascinating, because I'm a word geek, that these words and concept are so much a part of our speech that I can call my Witchfinder a sadist (which he SO is) without even questioning where the word came from even though I know where it did.
'Tis a puzzlement. However - I'm going to try and winnow out as many of these words as I can - I don't think stuff like "presumably" is necessary - but most of them can be replaced.
What do you think? How far would you go? What about further back? Step back from the 17th century and the language becomes even more obscure.. I'm planning to do an Elizabethan one at one point - and I'm certainly not going to be writing the entire thing in nonnys and nuncles.
In other news, the cover is done and I should have it soon. I'm crossing EVERYTHING for a good one.