Non dizzy!

[erastes]

Today is the first time I've not had vertigo for just over four weeks.  Phew. That was really unpleasant and I really never want that again. It was just bliss to walk to the car without hanging on to the wall.

I've bought myself a new universal remote control as my Satellite control simply never turned up (Lucius probably ate it) and it's rather swish - touch screen!  I love gadgets. It's just as well I have very little money or I'd bankrupt myself with STUFF that blinks and beeps.

I sent a shed load of troops (ok, 14) to recapture my six  boys who'd been captured. But the bastard captured THEM too. *growls* I'm an extremely bad loser, and if I can't win, I really don't want to play. I would like - overnight Santa if you are listening - 200 cavalry and about 40 catapults so I can go and bash that bastard to smithereens and GET MY BOYS BACK!!!  God knows what horrors those Teutons are perpetrating on them. And the insult to injury is that I'm having to pay for their keep!  He's not even feeding them! Ok. returning to sanity...

People who write in other genres - are writers as bitchy in your genres as they are in mine? Does Stephen King get really snotty with George R R M? Does Terry Pratchett bitch all over Jim Butcher?  (I put wank rather than bitch and then changed it hurriedly, that's not a vision I want in my head, thank you!)

The amount of nastiness, bitchiness and downright BILE I've seen in the last few days - (well, to be honest, ever since I've been writing, really, it just seems to have been worse in the last week or so) is so discouraging. Readers and writers who seem completely incapable of holding a discussion about anything.  When I was at school, one of the "arts" we were taught was debate. (No doubt our school was under the impression that we gels were destined for the House of Commons)  In debate you have to do that, argue against your opponent's point of view and the major rules were that you were never to lose your temper or make any personal attack at your opponent.  I've said before that when I came out of fandom I was like some fluffy bunny, sniffing in the sunlight thinking that mixing with professional writers online would be like some techno-Bloomsbury Set or the Inklings. We'd debate the merit of the written word, puff on imaginary pipes and wear virtual tweed with elbow patches. 

How naive I was.

Oh - and don't forget the Advent Calendar - it's still going!

Comments

[gynocrat.wordpress.com (from livejournal.com)]

People who write in other genres - are writers as bitchy in your genres as they are in mine?

The fandom apple doesn't fall far from the tree. :)

I can say that most of what happens in GloBL tends to stay in emails or at conventions.

I bring you this though, it tends to work in my genre:

http://gynocrat.org/butthurt.jpg

[erastes.livejournal.com]

BWHAHAHAHAHA!! i love it!

[pepperlandgirl4.livejournal.com]

The amount of nastiness, bitchiness and downright BILE I've seen in the last few days -

I have never seen authors in other genres behave they do in Romanceland. I've set a firm "No blogs" rule for myself (with 2 exceptions) because I have enough problems in my life without looking for more negativity.

Um....speaking of blogs, I owe you one, don't I?

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I just imagine the murder mystery writers all wanking over each other because someone wrote a private eye with a Luger or something and everyone went mad. It just doesn't seem real.

Do you? Well get busy then!

[enolabloodygay.livejournal.com]

Glad to hear you are feeling better at last! Keep getting weller, you don't need that shit distracting you from your writing. Or from the cats, or your friends or - shall I shut up now?

Slightly off topic, but sort of in the vein of authors bitching about authors, I got the new Deric Longden (Thermal and Tigger are still alive and well and talking to him) and I squee'd when he mentioned Pterry! I won't spoil it for you, you can head to the library and get the book, but it made me laugh out loud in the tearoom, and for once I wasn't in there on my own. Can you imagine having to explain BOTH those authors before being able to share what made you cry with laughter?

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Thanks hun. I admit to getting very scared, it had gone on so long I thought I'd done some damage.

I'll have to check that one out! He writes slower than me!

[suryaofvulcan.livejournal.com]

I'm aghast at some of the stuff I've seen in the 'professional' m/m world - it looks to me like exactly the sort of bullying-BNF behavior that I've heard about in some fandoms.

I seem to have been extremely lucky in my choice of fandom - I can't recall even one incident of wank. We all seem to be terribly polite and mature.

I'm honestly in two minds about whether I want to get into the the world on original m/m if I'm going to have to deal with that level of crap.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

It would probably be best if you are prepared for it, I simply wasn't. And you can avoid the places that make the worse noise. I'm just a masochist - and sometimes it just springs up in the last place you'd expect.

It is possible to write and publish without bothering with the blogs and stuff at all - probably best to, in fact.

[byrne.livejournal.com]

I got your lovely parcel today, to my great joy! Thank you so much! Two of my most favourite things on the entire planet -- a new book and chocolate!!!

This might mean that I have to marry you.

Thank you! :D

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Oh that was quick! Hurrah!

I DO!

[lee-rowan.livejournal.com]

There does seem to be a fair amount of bitchery, but then again... we're talking human beings, right?

I've met and am still very happy to know a bunch of really neat writers. I've also met (and wish I had not) a handful of diva wannabes who seem to have the fannish attitude that anything shy of worship is a mortal insult. I expect they think I'm as big a jerk as I think they are. Ce'st la vie. But y'know... I can't think of any segment of human interaction that doesn't have this going on. Jobs I've held, school... hell, even churches have their Church Ladies who seem to have narrowed their entire focus into being Teacher's Pet to the pastor. I don't think there's any escaping interpersonal politicking.

We'd probably all get more writing done if we didn't have the lists. I expect the social aspect of all this is useful in promoting books, but being in the 25% of the population that's introverted, I do wonder how extraverts ever get anything written.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

And this is all one of the reasons that I'm happy to be a hermit. I utterly loathe cliquery and bitchery online and even more in person. The level of "women together hating someone else" was massive at my last job. *loathes*

[anderyn.livejournal.com]

Glad you're not vertigo'ing.

I don't know what it is, since I personally prefer to keep my disagreements civil and to attack the idea, not the person when I do disagree.

Had to tell you that the sf story was wowza. Even if you don't like much sf, the story was great!

Um. I have a very sketchy smut scene written, but I have a query for you if I may.... What would a very correct and rather innocent Victorian gentleman call his penis? If he happened to be wanking off and someone joined him, as it were... I have no idea and cock seems wrong to me.

BTW, is gel still a common useage? I used it in the current ms when someone's hearty squire-ish father was talking and people gave me grief about it. I thought it was standard for hearty squire-ish types.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I'm so glad you liked my space-bois - I'm exceedingly fond of them myself and would like to do a full anthology of short stories about them at some point - I have another story (which precedes Traffic) but it's on my old PC and other than taking the PC to the shop and paying them money to copy the hard drive onto disk I'm puzzling how to get it off. I may just sit in front of it and copy by hand. Thank you! I LOVE SF to be honest, but it has to be a certain type of SF - Heinlein crossed with Firefly, which is rather where Teless and Kyrian came from.

I think that it's an American taboo that you feel cock is wrong - see this article

http://encyclopedia.jrank.org/articles/pages/595/Cock.html

membrum virile is possibly too flowery - prick, old man, arousal...

Sland and Euphenemism by Richard A Spears is a great resource.

Here's another great one. Anti-masturbatory devices!

http://www.isis.aust.com/stephan/writings/sexuality/vict.htm

No - gel's not in useage. It just makes me smile and reminds me of my hockey teacher.

:)

[anderyn.livejournal.com]

Thanks much for the info. I *think* he's going to be using "shaft", though maybe not.

Also, more space-bois!!!!! I really liked them.

"gel" isn't in common useage now, but it would be okay in Victorian times, no? (At least for the hearty type?)

I will be attempting to type the scene in tonight/today, and I will send you a copy, if you don't mind. I really need some reassurance that I'm not totally writing tripe! (And my writer's group is not into m/m.)

[erastes.livejournal.com]

oh yes, gel will work in a Victorian setting very well!

And no probs, i'd like to read it!

[chris-smith-atr.livejournal.com]

Glad to hear you're feeling better. Had a wander over to Dear Author (and gave Alex a synopsis of it)... seemed very (ponders how to put this nicely) territorial over there. Very opinionated. And very passive agressive. Just about pretty much everything I don't want going on in meta_writer. Interesting.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Generally it's a very nice comm--although just from time to time it bursts into bitchery. It wasn't that thread I was referring to, though, it was the hatchet job people did on Smart Bitches recently and a vicious "welcome to Samhain, Linden Bay Romance arses" at one of the Samhain chat groups.

As I said. There are ways to discuss and debate. One can offer one's opposing opinion without resorting to "you suck!" - and once you've gone done that route, you've already lost the argument. Perhaps it's an English thing.

[the-sea-to.livejournal.com]

I think the "you suck" is the product of small and threatened minds.

Smart Bitches. My ass. HAH. That is ridiculous. As for the chat group - I would suggest that Samhain need to get a hell of a lot more professional and control their groups if they want to keep authors like yourself.

*is indignant on your behalf*

So, I'm about 6000 words into new story. *grin* Vashtan showed me this thing called Etsy - because I'm typing in real time online and cannot format things, it means that I pulled 1800 words out of my arse in 45 mins. Not bad. And they were useful plot driving words too!

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I read a section yesterday. Cute scene where one boy gave the other a gift. It was delicious.

:)

[the-sea-to.livejournal.com]

HAHAH YOU SAW MY ETSY.

This makes me happy. If you want context I can send you the rest - but be warned, it is seriously rough. Day before yest I realised that I had forgotten to give characters physical features and had to go back and insert features. Most amusing. Remember Looshie and how everyone knew he had lovely long blond hair? *sigh*

[erastes.livejournal.com]

am v. happy to read - perhaps send me each chapter as its done?

[the-sea-to.livejournal.com]

Would be cool. I ama bit intimidated by chapters so am writing the bloody thing and breaking it into bits. No idea how long a chapter should be or anything. Aren't I sad?

[erastes.livejournal.com]

as long as it needs to be really - scene breaks will come naturally. no more than about 5k in general but it doens't really matter.

[the-sea-to.livejournal.com]

Ah thank god. I was worried. I figure if I keep a "segment" of plot with one decent revelation per chapter it will work. This is really weird, I'm so hyped up now that I'm writing again. Have all this random energy!

[chris-smith-atr.livejournal.com]

First tentative chapter sent. I hope you are feeling sane :)

[vashtan.livejournal.com]

It's called Etherpad - Etsy is an online trading community. :)

[the-sea-to.livejournal.com]

YES I AM THE MOST STUPID.

*hides*

[vashtan.livejournal.com]

Not stupid, just making sure you don't point people to the wrong place. :)

[the-sea-to.livejournal.com]

Thanks sweetie!

[essayel.livejournal.com]

Glad the vertigo has cleared up. That must be like having constant motion sickness - ugh!

As for bitchery you should hear archaeologists slagging each other off, or curators criticising each others professional practices. Emotionally charged professions are even worse. People, sadly, are people and a level of malicious silliness seems to be in the genes.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Worse than motion sickness-I still am prone to that if I'm not in the front or driving. This was just unable to walk straight, not sure where your feet were or the ground was. really horrid.

Ooooo - bitching archaeologists!!!! How inspiring! Indiana Jones/Giles hate sex! With Tweed!

*ponders*

[essayel.livejournal.com]

*whimpers* now that was a plot bunny I didn't need. I've got 40 years worth of Scythians to write first.

Real archaeologists are such fun - beardy and beery and irreverent and capable of obsessive delicacy teasing pieces of broken bronze out of the mud with a 000 brush. One wonders if they might apply such devotion to their relationships? Ah well, too late to find out now.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

NO! Never too late! Imagine what obsessions they could have over a lover! Imagine what intricate descriptions they would give to a lover's body.

ARGH! FIGHTS THE BUNNIES OFF.

[anderyn.livejournal.com]

*wants to read!!!!!!*

*has vast crush on Giles*

[suryaofvulcan.livejournal.com]

Sorry to butt in, but I'm having visions of an archaeologist delicately brushing the fluff out of his lover's bellybutton. :D

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Dies laughing!

Someone needs to write this.

[mychael-black2.livejournal.com]

I'll certainly second that...

[essayel.livejournal.com]

*hands Erastes patent bunny-bashing-broom*

[the-sea-to.livejournal.com]

Architect. Oh how I feel your pain.

[angelabenedetti.livejournal.com]

Well, since you mentioned Pratchett.... [cough] I was at a WorldCon panel where he was snarking with one or two of his uber-fans about how Maggie Smith played "the wrong witch." He'd wanted her for Esme Weatherwax, if there was ever a Diskworld movie. Which is all fine and wonderful, but the fact is that Maggie Smith made a wonderful McGonagall, there's not a Diskworld movie, and she might well be dead by the time they get one going.

I could've absolutely understood an expression of disappointment. But the three or four of them were snarking and dissing the Harry Potter books, like they were complete crap and trash compared with Diskworld. I'll admit I like Diskworld better, as literature, but Pratchett's nasty and IMO unprofessional attitude in public before an audience turned me off.

Sounds like exactly the same "My books are great and your books suck" kind of attitude you're talking about. :/

Angie

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Yes - I'd seen him criticising her books before, too - she made a comment that "she didn't think she was writing fantasy" and he riposted with something like: "well, i'd think that with the dragons and magic or something, she'd have got a clue"

I don't think i've ever seen "your books suck" on the forums I've been talking about, but it's usually on a discussion about something else, and suddenly things turn nasty - it's simply like people don't know how to take up an opposing opinion and expressing it without getting vicious.

[angelabenedetti.livejournal.com]

'd seen him criticising her books before, too

So he makes a habit of it, then? That's unfortunate. [sigh] It makes him sound peevishly jealous or resentful of her popularity. And what the heck does he have to resent? He's got a stack of bestsellers as tall as he is -- that sort of behavior just makes him look bad. I still love his work, but after seeing him at that convention I have very little respect for the man, which is sad. :(

I don't think I've ever seen anyone come out and say "your books suck" either, but when people get superior and condescending, whether it's author to author or publisher to publisher, that really seems to be the heart of it. If the snarker didn't think she/he was better, what grounds would she have for snarking?

Angie

[mychael-black2.livejournal.com]

Glad you're not dizzy anymore!

As for the rest... I've already told you in private how I felt, but it still astounds me (then again, maybe not) how utterly negative people can be, especially in this genre. I've all but dropped out of groups after the storm I endured, and it nearly destroyed me. But you know what? I'm still here. So are you, and all the others who've had to endure it. Just proves how strong such things can make you. I only hope future victims can weather it as well.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Nod nod. It will take more than personal attacks, personally motivated eviscerations and idiots who think that their opinion is going to matter one iota when it comes to a world view of anything. They need reminding that although they may be attracting 100 comments by their oh so unwitty nastiness, outside in the world no-one's heard of them or me.

[mychael-black2.livejournal.com]

Exactly. And eventually, people will simply tire of the negativity and find something more interesting.