There are no words..... Oh no worries! Let's nick some!

[erastes]

I'm so glad, in the light of the most recent plagiarism evidence regarding heidi8, that I've left fandom. It doesn't stop me looking in from afar with my gob hanging open in shock, though.

Everything that these idiots, and I use the word when I want to use something much stronger, weakens the very nature of the fandom they thrive in. Hundreds and hundreds of writers in fandom, and all anyone will see are the liars and the cheaters and the thieves.

And by "anyone" I mean the professional, paid writers. Ok Burnett and co are dead, but as melllvar says in this post (http://www.journalfen.net/community/bad_penny/11176.html?thread=3019688#t3019688) which I will quote as I couldn't put it better myself: "Plagiarism opens all of us up to larger legal problems. Right now, the creators of original works for the most part turn a blind eye to fandom and fanfic, because really, who is it harming? (Other than Anne Rice, of course. ;-) ) What do you think'll happen if these same creators suddenly start believing we're plagiarizing their works damn near word-for-word without a care in the world? Hear hear.

And these writers aren't kids. They aren't educationally sub normal women who can't string a sentence together, they are late 20's early 30's professional women (as far as I can tell) who find their own writing so lacking to themselves, that they have to COPY entire chunks of text from other writer's books and use them in pathetic fan fic about Harry and Draco? I mean... I'm utterly gobsmacked. Why? What does it achieve? Other than bad publicity (which is of course, good publicity, and will result in more book sales for Cassie Claire, which might be their plan all along I suppose.)

She was the biggest defender of CC, and know we know why, eh? I feel particularly offended, because she's stolen huge chunks of text from The Little Princess and The Secret Garden, two of my favourites. When she stole part of The Fatherland, it seemed she'd got fed up with trying to hide the similarities, and copied just about everything, including the character's name. You know, that was a challenge I should have had on hp_literotica "Plagiarism is bad but not if you move the words around (and/or call it an homage)"


I've asked Fiction Alley what they intend to do about it, as, as senior mods, they should be thrown out, imho and hard. They won't, of course. I doubt that FA is as professional as that, they would have already done it if they were going to. However if you want to add your voice to my dissent, email away: help@fictionalley.org Anyway, that's it. I'm saying nothing more about it. Here's a handbasket, fandom, *waves cheerily*

In much more amusing news, check out this site It's a site of "helpful hints" for packing for France.

Obviously for Superwomen, I would imagine, as it includes packing a week early, packing the car 2 days early (obviously the SPARE car unless you want to drive around with the packing around your ears for 2 days, and running the risk of getting it all nicked) and BAKING ferchrissakes. Who the frell BAKES before going to France - land of the most fabulous patisseries in the world? and of course, as you've spent so long packing and baking and getting the perfect nuclear family ready, you have tons of time to CLEAN THE HOUSE!

*screams in horror*

Comments

[sionnain.livejournal.com]

Me? ♥ you :)

I seriously couldn't believe that story. She plagarized Gene Wolfe--one of the most decorated and amazing writers of the century. With one of his most well-known quotes.

I read that whole thing and thought, "Wow, if you'd have put the same amount of effort into polishing your writing as you have into stealing other people's words, you might not have to do that anymore."

[erastes.livejournal.com]

That was my thought entirely too. It degrades anything - ANYTHING - that they may have written at any time. One (if one had the inclination and time) would be looking to see if it was original or not. Mud sticks and you never believe anything a liar says again.

I don't know if it's true, but I heard she was a lawyer. Perhaps that explains the deviant behaviour.

[nassima.livejournal.com]

I, for one, am sad that you left fandom. That's why I thought while I was reading all these comments under the Heidi report equating the HP fandom with plagiarism. I thought of all these great fanfic authors and soon-to-be published original authors in my flist, who would never, ever plagiarise.

Oh, and dear? Your art is in the post! finally... It should arrive in a few days.

♥

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Aw thank you sweetie. I didn't bother you about it, because I knew that you were having a tough time. I hope things are calming down for you

*hug*

[haydenthorne.livejournal.com]

That was a good response by mellvar. (I had to click the link out of curiosity though I'm not involved with any fandom whatsoever).

This one struck me as particularly funny (in one of the comments):

(And I just don't get people who'd rather read hp fanfic than check out the books from their library. They are giving fanficcers way too much credit.)

God, how true!

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Although I know I am adding to the bad/good publicity, I couldn't keep quiet. As several have said, I feel dirty by association, and it all makes me feel physically ill.

I feel like posting a fic based entirely on one of their stories, just for a laugh. Perhaps I still will!

I used to enjoy reading fic, but not as an alternative to library books, that would be destroying literature, indeed!!

[rwday.livejournal.com]

My Gawd. Does this never end? Anybody who has attended a college class in the past 15 years knows what plagiarism is. Many universities (most, probably) require professors to publicize the school's plagiarism policy at the start of each semester or quarter. Hell, when I taught 13 year olds, I started my English classes with plagiarism policy. There IS no excuse.

And Heidi is a lawyer. *headdesk* This isn't why I joined fandom. It makes me feel dirty by association, and I hate that.

[mysid.livejournal.com]

I've never read anything by any of these people, and I've been blissfully unaware of this entire sordid episode--until now.

Yuck. How incredibly stupid and selfish.

And I just don't understand why they do it. I write fanfic because I enjoy writing. What possible enjoyment can one derive from plagiarizing?

[gehayi.livejournal.com]

It's all about the fame and the reputation. By plagiarizing, Heidi and Cassie get attention. And because what they are stealing is largely by good and/or famous writers, they get a thoroughly undeserved reputation for being talented writers themselves, and scads of praise for "writing" something that was basically a copy and paste job.

I refuse to believe that they didn't know better. Heidi's a lawyer. Plagiarism was discussed in every single class I had in law school for the first WEEK.

Besides, how hard is it to know that you're not supposed to be stealing stuff that someone else created or invented? I thought that "don't take things that don't belong to you" was drilled into kids around the ages of five or six.

I'm disgusted.

And I'm ashamed that I ever wrote fanfic for the HP fandom. Right now I feel tainted by association.

[rwday.livejournal.com]

That's almost exactly what I said above. On the Bad Penny post, I think I expressed it as being covered in second hand slime. A lawyer and a journalist, two people who should know, who DID know darn well that what they were doing was wrong, people who were held up as exemplars to the rest of the fandom, have dragged every fanficcer into the mud.

This has hit some pro writer blogs now. I can understand people like Robin Hobbs and other authors who don't want their work fanficced when this sort of thing happens.

Am disgusted too, and very glad I've quit fandom. I know there are a hundred, probably a thousand fanficcers with integrity for every Heidi or CC, but I still feel dirty.

[gehayi.livejournal.com]

I'm glad I've quit fandom too...but there's a part of the fallout I still have to deal with. I've thought about it and I really don't think I can leave my fanfic up at Fiction Alley anymore. Not after finding out this.

I'd heard accusations about Cassandra Claire before. Problem was, there was so MUCH wank about it that I couldn't tell what she had done and what she hadn't. The Bad Penny posts were the first ones that detailed everything that CC had done. I didn't know until yesterday that Heidi had plagiarized as well.

And I'm not just taking Bad Penny's word for it. I checked out one of Heidi's stories, and starting looking for uncredited material by other authors.

I found two pieces of uncredited material--material that Bad Penny HADN'T mentioned--in about ten minutes flat.

Not good.

The thing that keeps bothering me now is--they're senior mods on Fiction Alley. And their stories are archived there, as are mine.

I don't think I can keep my stories there, or keep posting there. Not now. Not after I know what happened. Staying--for me, anyway--would be like my telling them that plagiarism isn't serious, that their actions weren't wrong in any way. Doing nothing puts my tacit stamp of approval on this. I'd be putting ease and convenience ahead of what's right.

And this annoys me. I like Fiction Alley. I do. It's a good archive--accessible to many readers, and large. And I enjoy the meta discussion threads.

But.

I can't go along with Heidi's and Cassie's actions. I can't shrug it off as a mistake, or say that it's only fanfic and it doesn't matter.

I know that I'm a very minor writer at Fiction Alley. I'm lucky to get eighty or so hits per story. Cassie and Heidi get hundreds of thousands of readers for one chapter. My leaving won't have any impact on the archive, or the readers, at all.

Nevertheless, I think I have to leave Fiction Alley... and remove my stories as well. I don't want to be tarred with the same brush as those two.

Maybe I'm overreacting. But I think this is the only hoorable thing to do.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I completely agree. Voting with your feet is the only way to express disgust. It probably won't make much difference, but all I can hope is that anyone with integrity will do the same (and they are the better writers in the main, after all).

I agree with both rwday and you, I feel completely dirty.

[mysid.livejournal.com]

"And I'm ashamed that I ever wrote fanfic for the HP fandom. Right now I feel tainted by association."

I'm still—nominally—in the fandom, and I don't feel tainted. Their disgustingly bad behavior has absolutely nothing to do with me.

When I was in school, I'm sure I had classmates who tried to get away with a bit of plagiarism in papers they wrote. I didn't. Did their theft reflect badly on me? After all, we did do the same assignment. Of course not. Did What's-his-name Frey's fictionalized memoir reflect badly on all memoirs? Of course not. Did that Harvard chick's best-selling debut novel, which was later revealed to be almost completely plagiarized, reflect badly on all novels on the best-sellers' list? Of course not.

The HP fandom is HUGE. Writers within it run from nearly illiterate to mind-blowingly brilliant—with most of us in the mediocre middle. I've never felt tainted by being in the same fandom as the Mary Sue idiots, so why should I feel tainted by being in the same fandom as these idiots?

Now, their positions as Mods at Fiction Alley is another matter entirely. I can understand wanting to distance oneself from them by leaving FA.

[schmoo999.livejournal.com]

Wow...I really have no words.....all of this coming out finally is just mindblowing and these are the so called big wigs of the HP fandom. Grrrreat. *eye rolling*

[erastes.livejournal.com]

It's horrible isn't it? *rolls eyes too*

[thatmadgirl.livejournal.com]

...wow.

Not for the first time, I'm glad to have missed all of the recent wank. Though I am afraid that some part of me is going to want to start watching Jerry Springer or something to fill the void.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

yes! it's very much like that now isn't it?

*giggles*

[maidenform.livejournal.com]

This is why I generally keep out of wank. *headdesk*

To repeat what it seems everyone else has said on this post, I feel almost ashamed to be a part of this fandom. And if they ruin it for all of us, all hell is going to break loose as far as I'm concerned.

I almost left HP a month ago. Hmm, maybe I should.

Add me on gmail? tesseract.dimension@gmail.com (I think I may have asked you that before, sorry if I am repeating myself)

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Now I don't agree with keeping out of wank. The voices need to be heard to TELL these people that is IT NOT ok. Hate wank, I agree, no point to it, but this behaviour damages fandom, and not just HP fandom, it could have sweeping problems for all fandom.

and I'll add you!

xxx

[maidenform.livejournal.com]

I see what you mean. There could be possible legal consequences for fanfiction if this kind of shit keeps up, right? *hates all those cunts*

[annephoenix.livejournal.com]

This is so shocking. I hope there are repercussions. there probably won't be :(.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

no - i don't think there will be either. I suggested a petition but it didn't go down well! I'd do one if I was at all bothered about fandom, but it can go frell itself as far as I'm concerned.

*G*

[rosie-red73.livejournal.com]

I have no energy to deal with wanky fandom since I was up till really late reading :D (will email you in a bit)

I did read the France packing site though, for fuck's sake! I'll be packing for Jersey in about two weeks. Let's see if I manage to pack the car two sodding days early. I'll still be shoving things into suitcases in the car on the way to the airport like I do every time we go away. And why would you bake? What purpose would that serve? I'm not sure the airline will consider it essential enough to put in my plastic see-through hand luggage bag.

[alafairnadia.livejournal.com]

I'm not entirely certain when it became okay to plagiarize writing, whether as a professional or fan. it's terrible for writers who actually work hard to write well, and really only gives attention to the people who don't deserve it.

[lyras.livejournal.com]

Bah. It doesn't surprise me, but still :(.

I just don't see the point - surely the idea of writing fanfic (for me, anyway) is to have fun and improve your writing? How exactly does lifting paragraphs from published works improve your writing?

[divinereverie.livejournal.com]

But see, that's only the point if you *want* to be a better writer and put the effort into it. They just wanted a quick burst of interweb fame.

[lyras.livejournal.com]

They just wanted a quick burst of interweb fame.

Yeah, and I don't understand the point of that, either. It was like the Msscribe thing - all that effort for a few minutes of interweb fame in Cassie's shadow=wtf.

[divinereverie.livejournal.com]

The whole plagiarism wank thing just keeps on going and going, and I am still sick about it. I noticed they screened your comment on one of the posts so I came over here to see if you reposted it here.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

i wonder which one that was? perhaps asking for people to get a petition together. Don't know why they screened it though.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

ah - found it.

I suggested that they run a petition, get a few thousand signatures and present it to Fiction Alley - get these theives off there. But they obviously didn't like me being so militant. Strange.

[gehayi.livejournal.com]

You could post the petition in _literotica_. It's on topic. Plagiarism hurts everyone.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I'm tempted, but i'm already being flamed for questioning Anjie/Ebony's motives!

http://www.journalfen.net/community/bad_penny/11945.html?thread=3358633