Crapathon, Bigots, SteamyAudio,

[erastes]

*Sigh* Well, I didn't get included in the Miss Snark crapathon, but with the run of luck I've had lately, I'm not particularly surprised about that.

Remember me telling you about the moderator's doubts that my type of writing would be welcome in the historical writers' critique group? Seems she wasn't wrong. I had this email from one of the Members (and I say that in my head as a euphenism for male sexual anatomy) yesterday.



If someone takes the time and trouble to critique my work, as a rule I reciprocate.

Unfortunately, I would not be comfortable reading a novel either about a male male or female female relationship.

This is because I believe sexual union is for the purpose of having children and to try hard to raise them to be valuable members of society. (This is not something I want to discuss in greater detail.)

I am not a fanatic who would turn her back on a homosexual or lesbian but I thought I should explain why I do not feel able to critique your novel.

Hoping you are not offended,

All the best,

I don't really know where to begin with this mail. It would have been less rude to not have written at all.

Sex is for procreation only is it? Should I list the number of times that it's not? And as for raising children to become valuable members of society...??? What she's really saying is "raising them to be NORMAL and not sick queers like you."

And "wouldn't turn my back on a homosexual or a lesbian" (although a lesbian is a homosexual, so perhaps someone should point that out to her) smacks horribly of "I'm not racist, some of my best friends are black." doesn't it?

I think what stung most was that having been as offensive as she could possibly be, she says "hoping you are not offended," with that attitude that people say "with the greatest respect" and then go on to disrepect you in the greatest manner.

I'm saddened that so called writers have this type of bigotry. I'm expected to review her heterosexual Regency novel (ok, it's not erotic, as far as I know, and I don't dissaprove of het relationships, obviously, being bi/pan-sexual myself) but I guess that's the difference, I don't dissaprove of any form of human love.


In much brighter news, there's a seekrit project that I think I can reveal, because we want new submissions!

I'm very proud to say that I'm part of the team at

STEAMY AUDIO

Download a sexy story to be read to you! We hope to be up and running by Christmas or Valentine's Day at the latest.

We accept any pairings, of course (*raspberry to bigot above*) but I'm particularly excited to see the gay submissions that are coming in. So Please - if you have gay stories to share, then check the submissions details and send your stories in. Most of you know my tastes, I'm not going to be impressed by "hammering dick shafts" so sensual erotica rather than boy pussies and shitters, please.

Comments

[julesjones]

Gah. All she had to do was leave out the third and fourth paragraph, and it would have been a perfectly polite note to let you know that she wasn't comfortable with m/m so couldn't crit your stuff. There was no need to say *why* she was uncomfortable.

The audio thing looks interesting, if only I could write more short stories at that length... Must check the Clean Sheets contract and see if I can submit the story that went up there last week.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Yes, she really did want to be as rude as possible, or perhaps in her fundie way, she thought she was explaining to the Thick Queer.

I hope you do submit something!

[electricandroid.livejournal.com]

What a silly person.

Honestly - I'm just staring agape at the screen. Completely lost for words.

Don't even bother to reply - that is my two pence...

I'm trying to get my new better half (well, 3 months new) to read more (he wants too, just being a therapist with a side of musician/actor, he does not have much time) - he's not adverse to reading homosexual stories, and his actual degree is in history - so he could be of some use to you.

Hope all is well besides this short *crosses fingers* spate of bad luck...

xx
ea

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Luck is looking up, I found my bank card, which I thought I'd lost last night and spent the evening searching the house for loose change (a good exercise as I found five quid of silver and pennies!!)

I did reply, but just to say "I was warned this might happen, and I hoped it wouldn't, saddened to see that I was wrong"

And I'm going to be offensively nice and critique every single one of her chapters. Because I'm horrible. *G*

New other half sounds interesting - and so glad to hear from you! *glomps*

Woah...

[vashtan.livejournal.com]

.... what a bitch. I hope her children turn out gay. All of them. It does wonders to a Christian Birth Machine to suddenly love somebody who is different. Oh yes. A healing shock.

And - I am currently going through several new ideas for my next project, I might end up writing historical stuff. And then join you in battle.

Re: Woah...

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Yes, love thy neighbour doesn't appear to have got through as a message, does it?

And yay! We need more historical gay writers!

[irreparable.livejournal.com]

Lordy. That's a nicely worded piece of...something you got. Maybe reply with something like 'Thank you for your response, however it seems we must agree to disagree on this matter as I do not believe that love is defined by gender or any such borders and that it is in fact far more important that the human race express their capacity for love - in whatever form - than suppress it by conforming to societal prejudice.' And end it with, 'Without prejudice, Erastes.' That's what I'd say at any rate.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

What a wonderful response! I wish I had the guts. *G*

In that way, I think I'm a hell of a lot more Christian than she is, as I actually accept her idiocy, more than she accepts that I might be writing about something that really happened. It's not like homosexual relationships started in 2000 after all.

[zoepaleologa.livejournal.com]

This is because I believe sexual union is for the purpose of having children and to try hard to raise them to be valuable members of society. (This is not something I want to discuss in greater detail.)

Bloody hell. Valuable members of society? Try telling that to some of the chavs around here who spawn hordes of kids presumably so that they can nick stuff from shops.

Even if she believes that (and I guess at a push she is entitled to that point of view) what sort of writer deliberately ignores something that is a part of the human condition? I mean, in an historical setting, the homosexuality of a character can be a powerful plot driver (I'm thinking particularly of times in society when same sex relationships have been taboo) - do they come to terms with it? How will others react? What if they suppress it and what if they then have children who find out? All those sorts of themes are surely fab grist to a novelist's mill. One of my favourite "real writers" Barbara Vine (I like Vine better as Vine, than as Rendell) makes this a common theme in her stories - the impact of the forbidden desire and relationship, and the resultant devastating consequences.

And I have to say as a het person, generally, when getting laid, "procreating children" was emphatically NOT part of my agenda...

coming my brains out usually was...

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I couldn't agree more. Granted, I started to write homosexual gay historical novels because I thought people would find them arousing, but as the plots went on, I found that the social issues HAD to take a major part in the books. In Standish, it's a more well-known "crime" than it is in Transgressions, because in the 19th Century it was often in the courts, there were cruising grounds in major cities, the Molly Houses were prevelant, the handkerchief code was invented and gays were making themself known. So (although I hadn't intended it) I had to deal with the consequences of being caught, the more I researched, the more I learned and so it went into the book.

Far more interesting (in my opinion) to read a bit of social history than just another Regency heroine and a dashing soldier.

And yes, that's generally my aim when having sexual relations. *happy smile*

[mroctober.livejournal.com]

Shakes head in disgust.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

*Joins you*

[asphodeline.livejournal.com]

Oh good grief! Not sure I would consier dignifying it with a reply. Maybe one day you should write about the traumas of the erotic writer!

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I've been thinking about doing some mem-wars, that's for sure!

[l-prieto.livejournal.com]

Geesh!

If she wanted to be nice, she should have just said, "no thank you." No need to get into that stupid business about raising kids to be valuable members of society.

Hmph.

Write on, erastes! Her delicate sensibilities may not be able to handle you, but I want your stuff out there so she can't ignore it :!

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Exactly. Or just said nothing, like most everyone else has done. I think they are hoping I'll go away. WRONG.

tHANKS!

[semioticwarrior.livejournal.com]

So I suppose het couples over a certain age shouldn't have sex because no children will come of it? Or infertile couples?

::SIGH::

Sorry.

Can't wait to hear me some steamy audio, though!

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Absolutely. And I guess she'd be the kind of person who wouldn't agree with people with disabilities or genetic disorders marrying - knowing that they MUSTNT have children, because to have sex knowing that you can't have children is obviously wrong too.

*snugs*

[schmoo999.livejournal.com]

Wow...just wow. I agree that she should not have written at all..but she did maybe in an attempt to get you to leave? I don't know. Whatever. We love you honey. And gee I have had sex way more than the twice it took to have my kids (since two are twins...I got a two for one)and I don't plan on anymore rugrats but gee at 36 I am still going to have sex with my husband.

Fear not sweetie some of us parents out here are trying to raise our kids to be whoever and with whoever they want and not to judge people at all based on anything but their innerselfs...which this lady fails at.

Don't have any gay stories myself...I am not the best at writing slash pairings..but reading them I have never minded..

love you!! xxxxx

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Thanks hun. I am much better today than I was about it yesterday, I had to sit on my hands to stop myself writing back.

love you too!

xxx

[maidenform.livejournal.com]

JFC

That person is just like my mother. She once told me that it is immoral to get married and not have kids, as it is immoral to have sex and not have a kid. *headdesk* Catholics are silly persons.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Unbelievable. So, if you can't have kids for a reason, then what? God is punishing you?

*headdesk*

My mother's a catholic too, but her hypocrisy was just as bad, as she used a coil all her life.

Where on EARTH is it written that Thou Must Have Children, anyway?

[thescarletwoman.livejournal.com]

*sigh* It's funny, I just had this conversation last night with a priest (episcopalian) and a teacher. Discussing how too many people point to the bible and go 'see, it's WRONG'. And that sheesh, love is love and just shut up about it.

And if sex was ONLY for the procreation of children, there would not be such things as birth control.

On a happier note, the audio thing looks REALLY interesting. Could be the kick I need to finally start writing that bunny that's been rolling about in my head. :)

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I'm just irritated with it now, I know that there are going to be people who will see Standish or Transgressions and go OMG Gay history!? Satan!!! But I won't hear about them, and if I get banned in 10 states, then yay! Bad publicity is good publicity!

But to do this Po-faced "You are perverted and I am going to heaven and you are NOT" is just disgusting. And then to add "I hope you are not offended."

If I wrote back what I WANTED to write back - and then added "I hope YOU are not offended" they'd be after me with burning torches and pitchforks before you can say Lube.

xxx

[janedavitt.livejournal.com]

Whatever her views, if she can't critique something as a piece of writing, regardless of theme, she's got a problem.

What a plonker.

Sorry you had to run into someone that closed-minded and stupid.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I absolutely agree. Somehow I thought writers were more open. How on EARTH did she manage to read Pride & Prejudice with the pre-marital sex?

*shrug*

Thanks!

[sm-malfoys.livejournal.com]

* jaw drops*
If I am wrong to critique a work you need to be able to put aside your personal views to look at content and style.


This is because I believe sexual union is for the purpose of having children and to try hard to raise them to be valuable members of society. (This is not something I want to discuss in greater detail.)

This puritan veiw is scary.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I agree with you. And I am going out of my way to remove any erotic pieces, I merely want critique, as you say, on content, historical accuracy and style. I know I can write a sex scene, I don't need their input on THAT.

[chaos-rose.livejournal.com]

Okay, so infertile-for-various reasons couples have to get divorced, as do women past the age of menopause, and anyone who has ever had a tubal ligation, hysterectomy, or vasectomy.

What a holier-than-thou smug little twit. Why is it every fundie I meet has Jesus on their lips, but never in their hearts?

However, I find it really, really fun to point out that if they're going to pick 'stone the queers' out of their Old Testaments, in all good faith they need to adhere to all the other prohibitions, too.

Like not approaching the altar of the Lord if there is a defect in the sight. Glasses? Out you go!

No more poly-cotton mixes for them, either. :D

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Nod nod nod.

I once read through the list of "abominations" that homosexuality is lumped in with. Most of them are common sense, specially about genetics which is pretty good for that long ago. However it only says "you will not lie with man as with woman" it doesnt' say "you will revile anyone who does" in fact it goes on to say that one should embrace diversity.

GRRRR.

Fundies. Hate hate hate hate hate.

[valarltd.livejournal.com]

*headdesk* *headdesk*

*puts on Activist Dyke Mom Hat*
*decides she's not worth it*


Some people, huh?
I refer her to the "Every Sperm is Sacred" Monty Python sketch.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Just how I feel, truly.

*beats head on wall*

[thistlerose.livejournal.com]

What a twit. Would she have trouble reading about a male/female coupling that wasn't for the purpose of having children? Or is she one of those people who thinks that pregnancy is a woman's punishment for having sex?

I bet she can't get laid

I am not a fanatic

Nope, just a plain, everyday bigot.

*uses hot new icon for you*

[erastes.livejournal.com]

*loses track of the debate, staring at the uber hot ...

icon.....*

[haydenthorne.livejournal.com]

Anything that's below my contempt doesn't deserve a comment. *skips asswipe email*

I might have something for the audio erotica. It's currently subbed out, but I don't see my chances as being good, anyway, so I can revise it once it gets rejected and submit it to you. It's experimental and has a lot of rhythm in the text, so it might work in audio.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Excellent! I hope you sub it (although I hope you sell it to someone else too)

*is conflicted*

[eroticjames.livejournal.com]

You should content yourself with the fact that you've probably published/sold more books then she ever will. :D

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Heh. Yes. Only one book, but perhaps more than she's published!

[themostepotente.livejournal.com]

I think I would make it my mission to stay in the group and piss her off.

Sexual union is for having children? She's either a holy roller or a right-wing conservative. Either way, she's a homophobe.

*licks*

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I shall, but if no-one crits my work, I dare say there won't be any point in staying, they can just give me the cold shoulder and I'll have to leave.

[txilar.livejournal.com]

She's just trying to make herself feel better by putting all the blame on you. Her note is a textbook example of psychology in action. Your racism comparison was right on the mark. I know plenty of people with that viewpoint. They aren't 'against' these 'kinds' of people, they just don't want to know they exist. They should, therefore, keep quiet and not make a fuss. *eyeroll* By extension you shouldn't write about them.

Well, my mama brought me up right: heap coals of fire upon the heads of thine enemy. Critique every damn chapter. And point out any instance of someone not having a child after union. Surely there should be retribution!

As an aside, relating somewhat to historical novel writing, I nearly ran off the road the other day when I saw an SUV with a license tag that said 'NOVELS.' It seemed the universe was giving me a sign. Or a firm kick to the ass.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I (as rwday often says) I am rather good at being bitchy by kindness. Nothing more irritating than having the Queer critique her novel and making her feel guilt with every word. Ho Ho Ho.

*giggling madly at the NOVELS licence* I WANT ONE, but we have stupid rules here, we couldn't have that.

But I hope it is the universe reminding you what you really should be doing.

[lyras.livejournal.com]

(this is not something I want to discuss in greater detail)

Which probably means she's come up against this before in RL or wherever, and knows she can't win the argument.

Ah, well. I'll keep my fingers crossed that others on the list don't have similar attitudes!

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I think they must do as no-one's critiquing me. I think it's a conspiracy!!

*G*

[malefics.livejournal.com]

Bah. She doesn't want to read m/m or f/f? Lah dee dah. When you get into a crit group, you read and critique. She comes across to me as a selfish little cunt person who joined up to get responses on only her own work. I cannot tell you how much I'd prefer not to read some of the stuff I critique in my workshops. Should I put out an email saying 'I never want to read another short story that is only about male to female domestic abuse?' 'I never want to read another piece of adolescent fantasy-realization drivel?' No, you read it and you find things you like and you make it better. I doubt all of my people wanted to read about vampires or twisted WWII gay fallout, but at least they weren't brats about it.

Also, your work is so beautiful and delightful, the genre should not matter.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

I completely agree. I've been reading Medieval Amsterdam, American Wild West, Regency, and others. None of which I like much but I think I've had good things to say, particularly in the light of knowing how to format professionally.

And thanks!

[iulia_linnea.livejournal.com]

It seems reasonable that you shouldn't extend yourself to read the homophobe's novel if she isn't going to read yours. The mods should understand that, shouldn't they, as this is a reciprocal reading group?

That is my reasonable thought. My unreasonable thought? What a bitch! What the hell is she doing playing with grown-ups? *growls*

[erastes.livejournal.com]

Oh no. I intend (if I'm not chucked off the group for having no critiquers) to critique every single one of her chapters...

*is evil*

[bloodrebel333.livejournal.com]

Fundamentalist frustration galore. Fucking whore bitch. As if she's never had sex for pleasure.

[erastes.livejournal.com]

She probably never has, she's probably one of these that "lies back and thinks of Dubya."